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Repowering the Wind Workforce: Rangel Renewables’ is Meeting Surging Industry Demand
This episode of the Uptime Wind Energy Podcast features Josh Rangel, founder and CEO of Rangel Renewables, a rapidly growing company providing renewable energy solutions. Josh discusses how he is partnering with community colleges to train new wind technicians to meet surging industry demand, his plans to expand into repowering projects with his crane company King Heavy Lift, the positive impacts of the Inflation Reduction Act, and how he is fostering a family culture and safety focus at his company during a time of unprecedented growth. The hosts also explore the global shortage of qualified wind technicians and what skills are most valuable for new hires to have. Throughout the wide-ranging conversation, Josh shares invaluable insights from the frontlines of the U.S. energy transition.
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Joel Saxum: Welcome to the Uptime Wind Energy Podcast. I’m your co host, Joel Saxum, and today, Allen Hall and I have a very special episode in store for you. Joining us on the show is a forerunner in wind energy growth and a leader in the U. S. energy transition, Josh Rangel. He’s the founder and CEO of Rangel Renewables, a company that’s been growing rapidly, providing renewable energy solutions to the industry.
And he’s also the visionary behind King Heavy Lift, a key player in the race for a greener tomorrow. But today, he’s not just a business builder. He’s here to share his invaluable insights into the wind industry, hiring the right technicians, developing their skillsets, fostering an amazing family style company culture and discussing how the IRA bill is driving unprecedented growth in our field.
Without further ado, let’s get started with this episode of the Uptime Wind Energy Podcast. One of the things that we talked about off air was the fact that you’re not, Rangel isn’t out to steal technicians from that company and this company and that company. What you’re really doing is adding to the overall talent pool.
Because that’s the problem we have as an industry. We have, there’s a batch of really good technicians and people within the industry that know what they’re doing and can do it. However, We’re not going to be able to sustain the growth in what we need to accomplish for our energy transition unless we take brand new green people and train them up and give them opportunities to succeed.
So how are you guys attacking that problem?
Josh Rangel: By partnering with the community colleges this is my big point that I get all the time. I’m interested, but I just don’t know what to do. I don’t know where to go. How do I apply? What are the steps? Do I need to go to a school that is requiring me to go for two years?
When you get a call and hey, we need 35 individuals in two to four weeks, can you support it? I necessarily can’t have somebody go out to a school for two years and then say hey, you know Call me back whenever you’re ready to go. And so Streamlining the processes as we identified. Okay. Hey The market is going to continue to grow, not enough, staff that can do the work.
Trying to do our best to now working with Aaron to educate those from our social media posts or to go to apply, what the steps are to take.
Joel Saxum: Absolutely. And one of the tools that you have to do that is you’ve got access to some funds too, don’t you?
Josh Rangel: Yep. So with the Houston Community College, there’s a program that we’re able to access now having Rangel Renewables and King Heavylift.
I own both businesses 100%. I can offer up to a half million dollars on the Rangel Renewables side and half a million dollars on the King Heavylift side to trades. And so upwards of 2, 000 ahead each year. So when I talk about a economic impact for making sure that. Again, as low cost effective for them as possible.
That way, when they get into the program, it’s one to two weeks, depending upon what certifications that’s needed. And then at that point, they’re off and running and then identifying with their field supervisor and are forming and leads. Where we can, again, support and make sure that these guys have a successful plan of action to succeed.
We just hit our two year mark of no recordables. And so again, that’s the men and women in the field making sure that they’re the one another’s keeper. We have programs to promote safety. So if you identify that a tagline was feared and didn’t need to go back in the field hey, document that and then we have an application that they can submit it to.
And then we vote on in the back office to see which is the most critical, crucial one that You know, was a big safety hazard and then whether it be beats by Dre or cool coolers, just having a laundry list of things that they would like for themselves. So now it’s Oh man, you got, you had a Yeti cooler and it had the Rangel logo and you get that brand of, the good cat safety of the month.
And then it’s I want to be able to do that. So then you get an influx of, Oh, I found trash. All right. All right.
Joel Saxum: Yeah, that program, the idea of having that direct field to office connection is crucial, because you always, no matter what industry you’re in, there’s always the, hey, safety meeting.
Everybody has the capability of stop work. Everybody has the capability of stop work, right? Everybody says that. But sometimes when you’re on site, it’s almost like the mob mentality, where you’re like, ah, let’s just get this thing going, let’s just do this. But you’ve enabled your people to actually Step aside, they can do it, can they do it anonymously or either, either way, they have a direct connection to maybe the people that aren’t at the field level to the back office.
You guys know exactly what’s going on right away. I have to think that your clients love this.
Josh Rangel: Today, we just passed our audit for our first year with an ISO. Fantastic. Now, is it necessary on certain accords? No, but if I know that all our men and women in the field and in the back office are going home to their loved ones every single day, that’s pretty better.
And so note that I’m again, back to the statement, I’m reinvesting the money that we’re getting from profits and putting it back into the business because this business will be generational. We will be a global entity. We will be a billion dollar company. But you have to instill the right ethics and morals and standards.
Allen Hall: So the last time we had you on the podcast was about a year ago, and I think we thought we knew what was going to happen over the next 12 months. And I don’t think that has gone the way we necessarily thought it was going to go. And I’m curious for you, especially with the repowering, all the things that are happening in the industry, and particularly in the Midwest, what you thought was going to happen versus what happened.
And where do you think we’re going in the next 12 months?
Josh Rangel: I’m very thankful for maintenance. Our port, our portfolio boasts of a large quantity of maintenance. 2020, we had a tremendous year on not only new construction, but 75 percent of our work was repowered. We did over a gigawatt of installation in 2020.
We did 10 out of 12 months, day and night. So we were around the clock and starting with, the management meetings going into the foreman. Going into toolbox talks and, having our morning roundups, then you work basically a 10, 12 hour day, and then you’re going into night shift. And then it’s doing the same thing with those guys and getting them ready and prepared and moving light plants and trailers and man lifts and making sure all that, is accounted for now with the change and going back into the political sense, then you have a change in power and where’s the money going to be allocated.
And you have your. IRA and what does that look like? And now when we are submitting our bids, what kind of apprenticeship program do you have? What taxes can you provide? As a minority business owner, OEMs, certain companies are now telling me you have to let us know that because we’re also required to utilize companies like yourself from the repowered standpoint.
Now that you have that transition of cash coming through the door, what it’s looking like for infrastructure. Now looking at, Hey, if we can align ourselves with transmission distribution, greenfield, brownfield projects, but in line with some of the electrical work that I’m familiar with, then I might, again, there’s going to be probably other areas for grants or opportunities for companies to grow.
I’ve also thought about, do I open up another company for the offshore market? I think maybe Texas offshore, something to that metric, but. Then again, does that align with another half a million dollars that I can provide to the trades to get them into the industry? And now I have access to 1.
5 million to be able to every year get individuals through, the schools and certification programs that are needed. So with Repower, we’re starting to get more RFQs and I believe that it’s due in part two, not only the RA, but the tax credits that are in line. More owners are saying, Hey, they’re the tax credits are there.
So let’s go get it. And then technology too has just grown so vastly and what you can do, then what you’ve done, even as five years ago.
Joel Saxum: Yeah. Another side of that, we’ve been talking with some people too, is everybody’s watching Repower and everybody cause you’re looking at the bright apple in the eye, right?
But one of the truths here is that in 2010, 11, 12, we also had a huge wind push. If you watch for installed capacity, there was a spike during those years. And now that buck is due, right? They’re all 10 years old. So they’re qualified for PTC. So not only is it the boom that we had back then, but the new apple of the eye today is a perfect storm for repowers and investment.
Josh Rangel: Right. And to that you deemed to ask the question why aren’t you guys just building the new town? Why can’t we just go new construction all the way through or as an owner? You’re thinking if the collection lines are, all the substations are in here…
Joel Saxum: It’s connection queues, grid queue. Yeah.
Josh Rangel: If I’m unable to save an extra five to 10 million on the civil side, and all I have to do is just take a few components off and add an adapter and then throw on the new technology, I think I want to go that route. And that’s where I, my personal opinion, but also, working with, several.
Higher ups that in the industry understand why that push for repower is there. Due to the fact of not only cost savings on the front end, but also with the tax credits on the back end as well.
Allen Hall: So that, does that change what you do over the next 12 months? I’m just curious as we see wind farms and you’re probably out there telling everybody like, Hey, that went from 10 years old.
You probably got to repower it and we’re ready. Does that change the way you structure what happens next? Because you see all that repowering happening in front of you.
Josh Rangel: Yes, sir. And this is gonna be in line with a question you had about king heavy lift. When you’re building new construction sites, crawlers are great.
They’re fantastic for what they’re doing, but on the repower side, and you’re moving from pad to pad, they want something a bit more mobile but also the cough for mobing in and demoing. Start to really jump in. So by identifying, utilizing hydro cranes, LTM, 1750, 1650, 1500, those cranes can really get after it.
And so with King heavy lift identifying role, what cranes do you want to go to market with and how do we want to make sure that we’re entering to be successful. And right now we’ve been subbing some of our cranes out on particular projects, but. As we’re moving into 2024 and going into 2025, what we’re seeing with repower projects and RFUs, let’s get a few of the hydro cranes.
That way we can start getting our portfolio built, the finances where they need to be revenue wise, because again, as I’m trying to move into the offshore market and you’re dealing with a billion dollar companies what Rangel Renewable is doing revenue wise and project wise. And how many cranes is King Heavy Lift and what type of lifts are you doing and in what capacity?
And so when you really put those together, now providing a full turnkey service to our customers, it really just makes sense to say. We trust them and we know that they can do the job.
Joel Saxum: Yeah. You become the solution provider, right? They’re saying we got a problem or we got a project. Let’s just call Josh and Aaron and the team, and they’ll figure out what they need to do to support us.
That’s the way you want it. That’s the perfect spot in the industry to be in.
Josh Rangel: For sure. And so that’s where. Really trying to strategize with purchases and getting manpower and aligning ourselves to make sure that again, if I know that we’re going to need another 150, 200 guys, girls in the next 12 months, what are we doing now to plan for it?
And again, align ourselves with purchasing of cranes and what that looks like. So super excited. Again, I say that we’re blessed and highly favored and doing a lot of great things. We’re in our seven year anniversary. So Friday going to supply, propose a few things and again, but when I look at it, we’ve really been operating as a true wind company the last four years, going into December.
To be able to say that. You just can’t put it into words. Yeah. So thankful and blessed. And I just remember it was like the first, I gotta read this first payroll, Lord help me. It like, and then it’s hey, I would look on LinkedIn. It’s what man, this is so cool. Their LinkedIn profile shows, wind technician Rangel renewables.
It’s like, all right, two months and then three months. Like, all right, people we’re seeing that, no one’s quitting. We’re doing this.
Joel Saxum: Yeah. Congrats, man. It’s not an, it’s not an easy road.
Josh Rangel: Oh yeah. No, not at all. And I probably, I know I make Aaron pull his hair out cause I’m like, Hey, we just started three new guys.
Are they on LinkedIn? Man, I just, they’re just trying to get on board. I’m like yeah, that’s fine. But LinkedIn makes sure they’re on it.
Allen Hall: Yeah. I do think you’re playing in a unique space at the minute, right? Because in business, particularly in the business you’re in, timing is everything.
That if you can ride the wave, you need to be riding that wave. And it become a little bit dangerous, right? That there’s a lot of money moving around and a lot of possibilities and not always, you may not always win that next contract that does that sort of change your perspective on what’s going to happen over the next 12 months in, in the sense of there’s a lot of activity, we can bid a lot of jobs out.
But we also know on the same token that getting good people on site can be difficult and to do the quality of job you guys have done, that there’s a standard you have to meet there. And does that sort of change your perspective on, Hey, we’re going to be much more selective on, on the tasks we do or the customers we work with going forward?
Josh Rangel: With wind, we can do wind and we knock it out of the park. On the King heavy lift side with cranes, I’m not just subject to wind projects. I’m also available for infrastructure, marine and construction sites. And we’re in the Mecca, oil and gas energy capital of the world in Houston. We have all the refineries, petrochem facilities, outages.
So really making sure that if we needed a pivot or diverse by the portfolio and say, Hey, we have these four cranes out and they were moving and moving the last 10 months, we might have a low for a month and a half. Okay. Let’s go move this to outage and they’re going to be out there for the next six weeks.
And then once the outage is done, we can shoot it back and it’s going to go back to the, projects in Iowa and it’ll be there for another 12 months. So really making sure that they’re not sitting, but also. Whether it be new construction, repower, maintenance is going to be pretty consistent. So we signed a three year service contract with a large OEM and it looks like we’re in line to do that with another OEM.
And wow, that’s great. Yes, sir. So consistently, we should be good on the maintenance side for. Blade bearings, main bearings, generators, gearboxes drive drains we’re doing a couple of nacelle swaps out in Colorado right now. We’re just small odd jobs, having to replace.
Whether it be fluids or oil or checking in on the batteries. And there’s just a plethora of things that need to be done. But again, it goes back to now being asked for BOP work a little different, but I’m open for it because again, that opens up another area for. New technicians to come into the industry and learn what we do.
Allen Hall: Oh yeah, absolutely. And that does force your people to have sort of a broader sense of skills, right? That if you’re doing BOP or you’re up tower a little bit, those are not always the same thing. And getting back to the training piece for here for a minute, that does mean, uh. Technicians, I know we use the word technician very broadly, right?
But that does mean that the technicians need to have some sort of basic fundamental skill, whether it be a mechanical or electrical even some civil work, that they have to have some area of expertise that they’re baselined in. Does that then drive how you select technicians?
If, we had a good example, we were talking to some companies up in Canada last week and they were going through this discussion about where to find technicians and What kind of skill sets are you, are they looking for? And one of the things that popped up was I don’t want somebody who’s just wind specific.
I don’t want somebody who just only knows how to fix blades or to grease gearboxes or whatever it is. I want somebody who has a little bit of a broader set of skills that can do, can be multiple things. Probably superior in one of those things at least, but has a broader sense of skills that the electrician can do.
Lubrication work or can go do BOP work. Is that the kind of person you’re looking for generally when you’re out and trying to bring new people on and for all these new jobs that we just created?
Josh Rangel: Yeah, no, great question. And it goes back to the culture of our business and making sure that we just don’t have people that are one sided.
If you hired me, I’m only gonna do blade swaps and that’s it. You’re probably not going to be a great fit because we have to be flexible and nimble. Our customers saying, Hey, we got to go shop out a generator. If you don’t know it, I’m going to put you with an experienced technician or a lead or a foreman that does, and go start to gain that experience.
Joel Saxum: Not just throw it, not just throwing them into the fire because you see that way too much in this industry, to be honest with you.
Josh Rangel: So identifying with our customers, if we’re going to start aligning with the BOP, having in house training. That way, if they are open for it, then it’s will get me in line with who’s already performing these tasks and then they’ll go through a week or two weeks worth of training to identify what those questions are and having labs to identify circuits and what they need to be looking out for, just basic maintenance work.
And again, it goes back to, there’s just not enough people in this industry, and we gotta go create them.
Allen Hall: That is so true, and that is industry wide, and we hear, Joel, we hear that all over the place. I don’t care what part of the planet we’re on at the moment, when we ask about technicians, same problem.
Joel Saxum: Yeah, you can be in Sweden, offshore in the UK, you can be in Italy, South America. Everybody’s like, where are we going to get these people from? How are we going to do this? The the global wind energy consortium, they came out with a report the other day and the statistics in it were staggering.
It was like with it by 20, I think it was 2040, they were saying 400, 000 new wind energy technicians globally, like 400, 000 people that need to be trained in the next. 17 years. That’s crazy.
Allen Hall: All right, Josh, thanks for being on the program. I, everybody wants to talk to you and try to connect with you. And I always say go to the website.
So you want to just tell everybody where they can find you.
Josh Rangel: Yeah. So if you’re wanting to connect, please reach out on our website, www.rangelrenewables.com or LinkedIn. I’m very active on that platform. And we have our social media platforms on Facebook. As well as Instagram and Twitter, the new X. So look forward to connecting with you guys.
And also our number to reach us at the office is 832-304-8328. Again, look forward to connecting and hopefully see you guys soon.
Repowering the Wind Workforce: Rangel Renewables’ is Meeting Surging Industry Demand
I was speaking with some friends earlier today about the decline in demand for plant-based meat, e.g., Impossible Foods and Beyond Meat. They suggested that perhaps these companies have insufficient PR, but I countered that the intensely negatively PR funded by the ultra-wealthy beef industry is more likely to blame.
When you read the words at left, ask yourself who wrote this, and more to the point, who “they” are. The implication, obviously, is that “they” are the woke communists who dare to offer an alternative to deforestation and the factory farming of cows.
Calculating the electrical load for home appliances is essential to ensuring that your electrical system can safely and efficiently meet your household’s demands.
Given that electrical codes and regulations may change over time, it’s crucial to consult with a qualified electrician and adhere to the most recent Australian standards.
This ensures that your electrical system is up to date and in line with the latest safety measures, providing you with a sense of security and confidence. So, here’s a guide to calculating electrical load for home appliances.
Calculating the electrical load for home appliances in Australia involves a systematic approach to determine your daily and peak-hour energy consumption. So, how do we calculate the electrical load for home appliances?
Let’s first understand what load calculation is.
What is Load Calculation?
Electric loading is the term used to describe a device that draws electrical energy. An electrical load utilises electrical power. It is typically in the form of current and converts it into various conditions such as heat, light, or mechanical work.
In simple terms, load calculation is like figuring out your home’s total power needs. It’s a crucial step in designing, sizing, and managing electrical systems to ensure safety, efficiency, and reliability.
A load calculation considers all the electrical appliances, devices, and equipment connected to the electrical system. The process can determine the necessary capacity, wire size, circuit breakers, and other components.
How to Calculate Electrical Load for Home Appliances?
Here’s a step-by-step guide to calculating electrical loads for home appliances in Australia:
List Your Appliances: List all your home’s electrical appliances and devices that contribute to the electrical load. Include everything from lighting and kitchen appliances to entertainment systems and heating/cooling equipment.
Determine the Power Rating: Find each appliance’s power rating in watts (W) or kilowatts (kW) on a label or nameplate attached to the appliance.
Some appliances might state the power rating in amps (A) and volts (V). To convert the information to watts, you can use the load calculation formula Power (W) = Voltage (V) × Current (A).
Determining Load Types: Electrical loads can differ based on their characteristics. The primary load types include:
- Continuous Loads: These loads operate for three or more hours at total load capacity. Examples include lighting and heat pump systems.
- Non-Continuous Loads: These loads operate for less than three hours at total capacity. Many appliances fall into this category.
- Motor Loads: Electric motors like refrigerators or HVAC systems have unique starting and running load characteristics.
Consider Duty Cycle: Not all appliances run continuously. Estimate each appliance’s average daily usage or duty cycle.
Calculate Daily Energy Consumption: To calculate each appliance’s daily energy consumption, multiply its power rating by its average daily usage. This will give you each appliance’s daily energy consumption in watt-hours (Wh).
Daily Energy Consumption (Wh) = Power Rating (W) × Average Daily Usage (hours)
Sum Up the Loads: Add up all appliances’ daily energy consumption values to determine the total daily electrical load in watt-hours (Wh). Remember to include fixed and portable appliances.
Most electricity bills in Australia are calculated in kilowatt-hours (kWh). To convert your total daily load from watt-hours to kilowatt-hours, divide by 1,000 (since 1 kWh = 1,000 Wh).
Total Daily Load (kWh) = Total Daily Load (Wh) / 1,000
Peak Loads: Consider peak loads besides the average daily load. These occur when several appliances operate simultaneously. Ensure that your electrical system can handle these surges in demand.
Considering Power Factor: The power factor measures how effectively electrical power is converted into sound work output.
Power factors must be considered when calculating loads, especially in commercial and industrial applications, as they affect equipment sizing, such as transformers and generators.
Voltage Drop: Voltage drop is a concern for long-distance electrical circuits. Load calculations should account for voltage drop to ensure that the voltage supplied to the loads remains within acceptable limits.
Sizing Components: The size of various electrical components is determined based on the calculated load. It includes selecting the appropriate wire size, circuit breakers, transformers, and other protective devices to safely and efficiently carry the load.
Safety Margin: It is advisable to add a safety margin to your calculated load. This extra capacity can accommodate unforeseen power usage increases or future electrical system additions.
Consult a Qualified Electrician: Consulting a qualified electrician is not just a suggestion; it’s a necessity.
A licensed electrician can ensure that your electrical system can handle the calculated load, guide you through the process, and provide reassurance that your system is safe and efficient.
They will consider factors like voltage drop, circuit capacity, and the size of your electrical service panel.
Codes and Regulations: Always follow the latest Australian electrical codes and regulations, which may change over time. Your electrician will be knowledgeable about these standards and can help ensure your system is compliant.
Documentation: Proper load calculations should always be well-documented. This serves as a reference for future use and ensures that electricians, engineers, and inspectors have the necessary information during the installation and maintenance of the electrical system.
Proper load calculation helps prevent electrical overloads, voltage issues, and potential hazards, making it a fundamental practice in electrical engineering and construction.
But how do you calculate a house’s electrical load? Let’s not get confused over terminology. In this context, calculating a house’s electrical load is the same as calculating the electrical load for home appliances.
How To Increase Load Capacity?
Upgrade Electrical Service
If your home or facility consistently operates near the maximum load capacity of your current electrical service, consider upgrading the service.
This involves increasing the leading service panel’s amperage and the utility’s incoming electrical supply. As it often involves significant changes to the electrical infrastructure, this task should only be performed by licensed professionals.
Replace or Upgrade Wiring
Install Additional Circuits
Upgrade Circuit Breakers
Energy Efficiency Measures
Utility And Professional Consultation
If your load requirements are significant, you should consult your local utility company. They may need to upgrade the transformer or lines coming to your property to accommodate higher loads.
Always consult a professional electrician when considering changes to your electrical system’s load capacity. Electrical work can be dangerous, and incorrect modifications can lead to many hazards and damage to appliances and electronics.
What Is The Average Power Rating Of Home Appliances?
The average power ratings of home appliances in Australia are generally similar to those in other countries.
However, power ratings vary depending on the appliance’s brand, model, and efficiency. Additionally, energy efficiency standards and labels are used in Australia to encourage the use of more energy-efficient appliances.
Refrigerator: Average: 100-800 W (varies with size and efficiency)
Microwave Oven: Average: 600-1,200 W
Oven: Average: 2,000-5,000 W. Electric ovens mostly have higher power ratings than gas ovens.
Cook top or Stove: Average: 1,200-3,500 W per burner
Dishwasher: Average: 1,200-1,800 W. Some energy-efficient models may have lower power ratings.
Washing Machine: Average: 300-500 W for standard models
Clothes Dryer: Average: 3,000-5,000 W. Electric dryers have higher power ratings than gas dryers.
Air Conditioner: The average power requirement for window units is 1,000-5,000 W. Central air conditioning systems can vary widely in power requirements.
Water Heater: Average: 3,000-6,000 W. Tankless water heaters may have higher power ratings during use.
Television: Average: 50-400 W
Computer: Average: 100-800 W. Energy-efficient desktop computers use less power.
Lighting: The number and type of bulbs used vary widely. LED bulbs are highly energy-efficient and typically use 5-20 W, while incandescent bulbs can use 60-100 W or more.
Ceiling Fans: Average: 10-100 W. Ceiling fans with lights may have higher power ratings when the lights are on.
Appliances’ actual power consumption can vary based on their specific features and usage patterns. Energy-efficient models labelled with star ratings are widely available in Australia.
These can help reduce electricity consumption and lower energy bills. To find the precise power rating of a particular appliance, refer to the manufacturer’s documentation or check the label on the appliance itself.
It should provide detailed information about its power consumption.
Contact Cyanergy for a proper energy audit for your house. Get a free quote or talk to an expert.
Your Solution Is Just a Click Away
The post #1 Guide To Calculating Electrical Load For Home Appliances appeared first on Cyanergy.
https://cyanergy.com.au/blog/1-guide-to-calculating-electrical-load-for-home-appliances/
Weather Guard Lightning Tech
Vestas Buys LM Wind Power Factory, Increased Data Center Demand
This week we discuss uncertainty surrounding the IRA bill, GEV Wind Power’s acquisition by Certek, and the sale of an LM Wind Power factory to Vestas. Plus Blackstone is in talks to acquire TXNM Energy, pointing to increase data center demand. Register for the next SkySpecs webinar!
Sign up now for Uptime Tech News, our weekly email update on all things wind technology. This episode is sponsored by Weather Guard Lightning Tech. Learn more about Weather Guard’s StrikeTape Wind Turbine LPS retrofit. Follow the show on Facebook, YouTube, Twitter, Linkedin and visit Weather Guard on the web. And subscribe to Rosemary Barnes’ YouTube channel here. Have a question we can answer on the show? Email us!
You are listening to the Uptime Wind Energy Podcast, brought to you by build turbines.com. Learn, train, and be a part of the Clean Energy Revolution. Visit build turbines.com today. Now here’s your hosts, Allen Hall, Joel Saxum, Phil Totaro, and Rosemary Barnes.
Allen Hall: Well, welcome to the Uptime Wind Energy Podcast, Joel and Rosemary.
It’s been an exciting week. A lot going on in a, in America in regards to what’s gonna happen with the IRA bill. Nobody knows the, it’s like, uh, as tense, as tense can be. You, you don’t even really see a lot of articles about it at the moment. Everybody’s just in, in kind of hold mode, like, hold your breath and hope something bad doesn’t happen.
Joel Saxum: I think the interesting thing there is when something like this pops up, you would tend to see a lot of LinkedIn opinions and you’re not. I think a lot of, a lot of people are kind of moved. They’re kind of, [00:01:00] nobody’s really saying too much. We’re kind of waiting to see,
Allen Hall: yeah, waiting for that spicy take.
Usually from Rosemary, but she hasn’t written that article yet. It must be coming. Rosemary.
Rosemary Barnes: Well, I haven’t been writing a lot of anything on LinkedIn recently. Um, yeah, a bit, I’m bit busy. I got, I got really sick of, uh, LinkedIn as well when I, I over posted for a few months and. I got over it. Started, started to hate it when people would, would write a comment on my post.
Yeah. And I’m like, just stop talking to me. Go away. And I’m like, yeah, you were the one who made this post. So you That was my, that was my sign to, um, yeah, to, to move away for a little while. Yeah. But it’s also, uh, I mean, you know, like I, it’s not a topic that I am an expert in. ’cause obviously I’m, you know, I don’t live there, so I’m not, yeah.
I have. I have heard a few podcasts talking about it. Um, there’s that one. Um, uh, do you guys listen to that podcast? That’s, it’s like [00:02:00] the original Energy gang crew, but none of them are on the Energy Gang anymore. Now they’ve got their own new podcast. It’s like Dig Ashore. And, um, the other two, sorry, I don’t, I don’t remember their, their names.
Joel Saxum: They just started
Allen Hall: that one.
Rosemary Barnes: It’s called, maybe it’s called Open Circuit.
Allen Hall: Oh, maybe I have, yes, I know what you’re talking about.
Rosemary Barnes: It, it’s really good. It’s very, uh, it’s too American Central for me to listen to every episode, but for, you know, Americans then, I’m sure that that’s, uh, that’s good. Um, they, they speculate a fair bit about it.
Um, and also the, um, podcast that has Jesse Jenkins on it, which is called Shift Key, um, they talk about it a bit as well. So I have, I have heard a fair few takes on it, but, um. Yeah, I don’t know. I’m, I’m waiting to see, to, to be honest, as a non-American, I’ve just written off American Wind Power for the next few years and, uh, you know, just like, wait, wait, wait a little while to like, uh, get started again.
But it, you know, it doesn’t affect me so much. I don’t, I, I don’t have [00:03:00]projects in America. Um, so I. Not affected day to day,
Joel Saxum: a and a half a dozen part load leads that I was in a hand, but now I’m not gonna
Rosemary Barnes: do. You know what though? I, it is actually incredibly challenging for me too because, um, Australians and probably every non-American, like I, my business insurance will not cover me in the us They just absolutely not.
There is not, it is not possible for me to get insurance. To do projects in the us Um, and it would only be possible if I actually started an American company. That would be the only way to do it. So, um, that is a big disincentive for me to expand into America. Um, just ’cause your legal system is very, very different to the rest of the world and um, yeah, insurance companies won’t take that risk so.
That’s why that, that’s why I’m not expending to America. But you know, the rest of the world is a big place. So,
Allen Hall: well, if you don’t spend all your time on LinkedIn, then maybe you can then join us on the webinar. We have an up on Wednesday, May 28th at 11:00 AM East Coast, US and it’s about lightning damage and lightning [00:04:00] strikes and it’s one of another, one of the monthly Sky Specs webinars with uh, PES Wind and the Uptime Wind Energy Podcast.
We have some really interesting guests. In this one, Matthew Stead from eLog Ping and Matt Segal from EDF. So if you know Matt Segal, uh, he knows his way around blades and blade repair and he has a really solid approaches on how to deal with the damage, that’s gonna be a great discussion. So if you have lightning damage and pretty much every operator that I’ve talked to has some lightning damage at the moment, uh, you’re gonna want to attend that.
Webinars free. So it’s Wednesday, May 28th, 11:00 AM. East Coast and you just sign up in the show notes below. Really simple
Joel Saxum: as busy wind energy professionals, staying informed is crucial, and let’s face it difficult. That’s why the Uptime podcast recommends PES Wind Magazine. I. PES Wind offers a diverse range of in-depth articles and expert [00:05:00] insights that dive into the most pressing issues facing our energy future.
Whether you’re an industry veteran or new to wind, PES Wind has the high quality content you need. Don’t miss out. Visit PS wind.com today.
Allen Hall: So the big news of the week, well there’s actually a couple, uh, big news articles this week. Uh, GEV, wind Power, which is a large repair company. Based in the uk, but they have a lot of their business in the United States.
Uh, was acquired by a company called CEC and Joel just doing some research on cec. It looks like a holding company. That’s what it seems like to me. It’s owned by David Harrison, who is based in the uk and it just looks like they’re gonna continue to, uh, try to grow GEV, but it also includes Wind Power Lab from Denmark and rig com.
Joel Saxum: From Australia. Yeah, they group their ctec. Um, I know that GEV Wind Power is, um, they, they have huge plans for growth, right? They’ve got the office in Dallas office in [00:06:00] Poland, the Wind Power Lab office in Copenhagen. Rig com office, I believe is in Melbourne, down in Australia, down by Rosemary. And then they have of course the big office for the UK and Hull and that’s for offshore and onshore.
Uh, but they’ve also just not opened another office up in Canada. So big, big expansion plans for GE v windpower. This CEC capital injection, uh, is gonna help for sure, right? They’ve got a, they’ve got a existing our infrastructure, uh, for the GEV WINDPOWER group. Uh, and they’re gonna keep ’em all in place and they’re just gonna con continue to grow.
So, uh, look to see some more things coming out of the, uh, GEV group. Put this injection to cash.
Allen Hall: Yeah, because GEV, when Power Lab and Rcom were part of the Bridges Fund, which was owned by Hojo
Joel Saxum: Well Bridge, so Bridges was a technically a think minority shareholder in the GEV group. Uh, but that was Goldman Sachs money, uh, bridges was right.
So now, now we’re going, CTEC is Macquarie money, so [00:07:00] Australian money. Being injected in. Well,
Allen Hall: that does make a little bit of sense though. Australia is gonna be a huge renewable powerhouse. It already is. So it makes sense that a Australian money would be involved in this because, uh, yeah, there’s gonna be a lot more wind turbines in solar activity in Australia.
It’s gonna pick up pretty well, so might as well grab a company early while you can and, and continue to grow it. The other thing that that happened today was LM wind power. Selling a factory up in Poland to Vestus. Now, we’ve all talked internally about what is happening at LM Wind Power because they’ve had a a number of staff reductions over the last year or so, and then they had the blade problem up in Canada.
It does seem like a lot of the design activities are moving towards the United States from GEs point of view. [00:08:00] That leaves a lot of LM factories with that are making blades for somebody else. Rosemary, when you were there, uh, LM did make blades for almost everybody for quite a while. It looks like they still do, but now they’re selling off the non GE factories.
Is that the plan?
Rosemary Barnes: I, I don’t know what the plan is. Uh, um, yeah, not inside anymore, so I don’t have any insider info, but, uh, I did spend. Quite a lot of time actually at that factory in Glen. And it’s definitely one of my favorite, favorite wind turbine blade manufacturing facilities that I ever visited. Um, they get a lot, they get a lot done there.
That is like what I could say. The team there is amazing. They, the amount of stuff they can get through in, you know, one shift is like. Double what it is in some other factories. So I think, you know, from, from that perspective, without knowing what best has paid for it, I think it’s a, um, a good call if they get to keep the personnel.
Um, so yeah, [00:09:00] it, um, good for Besters. I was actually looking at some information recently, something unrelated, but I, I came across some, um, research reports. Actually. There were academic papers and it had, um, they had gone through all Vista’s recent, um. Like, uh, all of their annual reports and also all the other listed companies.
So there’s, you know, there’s a few listed wind, turbine blade manufacturer, wind turbine manufacturers, um, where they will give, you know, a breakdown, public information, a breakdown of how their money is spent in profits and that sort of thing. Um, and they had this little chart that showed how much, um, the different manufacturers that they looked at, how much they were spending on their staff, and how much they were spending on research and development.
Vest, uh, staff were paid far more than the other, um, manufacturers that were on there.
Joel Saxum: That’s geopolitical though, right? Like Siemens, Siemens Committee said a lot of employees in Spain, they just, they’re cheaper employees, a cheaper labor force than it is in Denmark or Germany.
Rosemary Barnes: But also, so that, but also, [00:10:00] um, investors spent way more on research and development than, than the others.
And that’s like, I have gotten that impression, you know, ’cause like a lot of what I do with my YouTube channel is. Looking at new, new kinds of things that people are doing. And time after time, it was vest that had investigated this interesting thing. You know, like vesters are the one that have the, um, have tried a multi rotor design out and like actually to the point of making a prototype and, um, installing it.
Vesters are the ones that have done the in cable stayed, um, tower and, yeah, like again, put it up the, you know, like over and over again. There were these things where they maybe didn’t even believe that there was an imminent commercial case for this technology, but they were doing it to, to learn and just improve their general knowledge and to also.
Um, be ahead of the curve when things changed enough to make this new technology maybe make sense now they would have the information they needed to move, move fast on that. Well, that’s my, my take on why that makes sense to them. So, yeah, I, I, I do, I am starting to get the impression, and I’ve never worked at [00:11:00] Vestas or even, I never even did a blade project for Vestas while I was working at lm, but that’s definitely the impression that I’m getting, that the, you know, they’re kind of retaining more of the essence of the original.
Danish wind turbine companies, then the others have more become globalized, Americanized or yeah, like, um, Spain fight or you know, like what, whatever. From all the mergers that have happened, um, the culture has been diluted, but, but festers, I still, still see pushing the envelope. I mean, they haven’t always been profitable, so, um, you know, is the strategy right or not?
But then, you know, every western manufacturer and every. Every, every wind turbine manufacturer, no matter where they are in the world, including China, um, have had periods of unprofitability. That’s for sure. So, yeah. Um, I, I just think it’s interesting that they’re taking a real different approach.
Joel Saxum: Well, that’s what I was gonna say, uh, kind of rosemary before you jumped, said it’s cultural thing, right?
Like, they’re vestas, they’re Denmark, they’re the, the, you know, I guess you can, you could have this argument [00:12:00] between the Danish and the Dutch about who wind power kind of. First, there’s a cultural thing there too, right? Like you have DTU right there, you have the university at our, I wanna say it, right, orus.
Uh, but you have, you have all of these different facilities there that are also lending to that research, right? There’s a lot of grant money that gets funneled through DTU. And if you look at those projects with those couple of universities there in Denmark, you see a lot of times Vesta is tanked. On those projects.
There may be some other, um, third party companies or a lot of it being sponsored by the university, but you see Vestas in a lot of those. So I think it’s a, I’d like you said, I think it’s a cultural thing that the Danish still haven’t be, that still haven’t, that it’s a good thing that they’re doing what they’re doing.
I, in my opinion, but that they haven’t become. This larger global fired thing, right? Where they’re still kind of sticking to their roots?
Rosemary Barnes: Yeah, I mean, I like it as an engineer and I will say that a lot of, um, my best ex colleagues from LM have ended up at Vestas. Um, so, you know, I think that they are, they do, they do [00:13:00] attract, you know, like people who like to work on really interesting problems.
But I also have been around long enough to know that, um. The most interesting engineering problems are not always the most business savvy things to be working on. So that’s why I don’t wanna comment about it, you know, as a business strategy or, you know, suggest that, you know, investors are definitely going to, you know, remain dominant in the future.
Um, because a lot of the times the, you know, like over engineering is a thing and, uh, you can’t be competitive if you have you, you know, like a good, good engineering is really about. Doing the minimum that you, that you need to make the product that succeeds in the, in the market. Uh, doing any more than that is very satisfying to an engineer, but, um, it is not the, not usually the smartest thing to do for, you know, making a profitable business.
So
Allen Hall: good engineering is knowing when to stop. Which is the hardest part of engineering. ’cause you never wanna stop. You need to stop and make some money. Yeah. [00:14:00] Don’t let blade damage catch you off guard. OGs. Ping sensors detect issues before they become expensive. Time consuming problems from ice buildup and lightning strikes to pitch misalignment and internal blade cracks.
OGs Ping has you covered The cutting edge sensors are easy to install, giving you the power to stop damage before it’s too late. Visit eLog ping.com and take control of your turbine’s health today. So private equity, giant Blackstone’s infrastructure arm is reportedly and talks to acquire TX and M Energy, which is Texas and New Mexico.
And so utility companies serving about 800,000 homes and businesses across the New Mexico, Texas area. Uh, the discussions are still fluid. There’s not a lot of details. However, it does seem like this is a play by Blackstone to maybe set up some data centers and to get. In line to get a data center set up is really hard to do right now because you have to talk to an existing operator and [00:15:00]get them to get approvals and there’s paperwork and there’s applications.
Once you buy, uh, a large energy producer, you can kind of control that a little bit and there’s reasons to do it because Texas and New Mexico, there’s a lot of real estate there. Renewables are really easy to install. It makes this acquisition. Much more desirable, I think just because of where it is now.
TX and M was going to be acquired a couple months ago, Joel, by Avan Grid, except that got stopped by the administration. Uh, that was about a year ago, right? Where that deal got canceled for. Was it competitive reasons or was it because it was. Avant grid, which is not a US entity is, is that what the deal was?
I don’t remember
Joel Saxum: exactly why it got canceled. I just know that it was a regulatory approval thing. It wasn’t a, it wasn’t a due diligence problem or anything like that. It was just regulatory approval, [00:16:00]
but.
When I, when I read this article, I thought immediately, have you guys ever, have you guys ever seen the movie Inception?
No.
Rosemary Barnes: Yeah, you gotta say Inception. What’s wrong with you, Alan? Oh my God.
Joel Saxum: In the movie Inception, they, they have an issue where they’re like, we need to convince the pilot of the plane to do this, and we need to convince the stewardesses to do this, and we need to convince the, the, this person to do this. And they have a really rich fellow with them.
And they’re like, how are we going to get past these problems? And he’s like, I’ll just buy the airline. So in the movie, the guy just buys the airline and then he gets to do whatever he wants with the airplane and, and how they do their inception tricks, whatever. That’s exactly what I thought about when I saw Blackstone do this, right?
We wanna get these data centers on, we wanna do this, we wanna do this. It’s like, man, this is gonna be, this is gonna be difficult. We’re gonna have to convince all these people. We’re gonna have to do this regulatory approvals and get in line and queues. It’s like, what if we just buy the power company?
Okay. Just do that and you can do whatever you want
like
that. That [00:17:00] makes sense. I think it’s a genius thing and I think it, I’m surprised that it’s taken this long to do it and there hasn’t been some other larger players that have tried it. So I just just saw a thing yesterday, a chart that said there’s over 5,300 data centers in the United States right now.
It’s like 5,386 or something, which is Corey way, way larger than I thought it was. And we’re, and if you look at a global scale, we’re way in front of the next person. And I don’t remember exactly what it was, but everybody you talk to in the energy world is going, Hey, more data centers, more data centers, more data centers.
And it is, it’s, it’s, I listened to a podcast theater. They’re talking about wait until you see the next six months. What’s gonna happen with data centers? As, as you see, Google searches declining for chat GT requests. It’s gonna be all data centers.
Allen Hall: So EPRI is saying 48% of utilities nationwide are now receiving data center requests exceeding one gigawatt with almost half facing requests that exceed [00:18:00] 50% of the system peak demand.
Wow. That’s a lot of energy to be requesting.
Joel Saxum: So last summer, peak demand in Ercot, and I’m gonna talk Texas right now, right? ’cause this is where a lot of these data centers are going. ’cause Ercot is gonna, the Wild West. T’S peak demand last summer was 87 gigawatts at one point in time. They have it projected by, I think it was like 2031.
That peak demand is gonna be 213 gigawatts. And
Allen Hall: is that based on population or is that based on data center growth,
Joel Saxum: data center growth. That’s only five years away, six years away, and you’re talking almost triple the demand.
Allen Hall: Can, can we veer off just slightly on this discussion, which is the existing talk about the IRA bill and how they wanna change it.
So it’s gonna be harder for renewable companies to apply for the tax credits and production tax credits and all these little nuances that add up to something much more massive. They’re, [00:19:00] if the administration does that. And Congress passes it and whatever else happens, okay, fine. But in this data center demand, you cannot get enough gas turbines built to support that.
You can’t order one
Joel Saxum: and receive it before 2030. Right. So what are we talking about? You have to put solar and wind on the grid right now. ’cause it’s the only energy generating facility that’s, that’s that’s timely enough to get to meet demand. Right.
Allen Hall: Those, we just do not have the infrastructure right now in the United States or elsewhere.
Like a Siemens who makes a lot of gas turbines, can’t supply the demand. That’s about to happen. So the demand is gonna get so dang high. You’re gonna, you’re gonna go from 20 29, 20 30, uh, order book to 2035 order book probably in the next six months, the way it sounds. What are they
Joel Saxum: gonna do? Could you see a player that doesn’t, that knows turbines but doesn’t [00:20:00] do gas fired turbines coming in?
I don’t know who all the players are, right? I know GE sells ’em. I know a couple others, but like, like a steam, like a Rolls Royce is Rolls Royce sell gas turbine power plant turbines. They know. They know turbine technology couldn’t. Why? If you were them, wouldn’t you look at this demand and go. We should start building these things.
Allen Hall: Joel, to build a gas turbine is really difficult. It’s like building a jet engine. On steroids, it’s, and to make it something that’s really reliable, it is not easy. That’s why it takes so long to build these things. It’s not just a startup. Well, yeah, what are you gonna do? Build a second factory next door to the one you have and spend a billion dollars to set this thing up.
But you’re not gonna be able to make the first turbine for at least five or six years. That makes zero sense, because all of a sudden if the data center, uh, compute goes away, like some software engineer figures out how to do this a lot with less power, basically a lot less power to do it. Then poof, all their order book disappears and all that money they spend on a [00:21:00] factory disappears and no one’s willing to take that risk.
So who’s steps in the middle of this besides wind and solar and some batteries? Wind and solar betters right to, that’s the fastest way to get power onto the grid, even if it’s disconnected from the main grid, right? Even if you go geothermal,
Joel Saxum: you still need turbines. You still need turbines. Turbines are not quick to make.
And you can’t build a nuclear plant in about 10
Allen Hall: years. No. So what are we, Rosemary? What are we doing? And here’s my thought this morning. I woke up this morning like, this is a huge problem. What are we gonna do? My first thought was like, well, everybody’s gonna go to Australia because the power is plentiful and it’s only a data cable to America.
That’s what’ll happen. Rosemary?
Rosemary Barnes: Uh, I don’t, I don’t think data centers, I think data centers is primarily a US problem, and then there’ll be a few, and not even like, it’s, it’s localized within the US as well. People aren’t just like, people think with this, you know, data center growth that it’s like.
Everyone’s gonna worry about it. But you need data [00:22:00] centers, um, near where the, you know, the tech companies, the AI companies are, because they don’t, you know, they can’t be located on the other side of the world from where their data center is, if they’re gonna be, you know, running all these, um, these learning models.
And then you need them near population centers as well for, um, you know, so that they have them, them close by. I think the biggest thing with data centers that’s gonna be different to what everybody’s panicking about is that it is not gonna be the, um, the, the demand people are predicting is not going to come, come true to anything.
Like the extent, extent that what has been predicted. I think it will grow and it will grow a lot, but I, I, you know, like the growth that people are predicted is, um. Well, IM implausible for a start to actually achieve it. But I think also, like if you look back through history, I mean, you know, people always predict, you know, that you get a big amount of growth early on and people don’t really know what the, you know, the size of the exponent is.
And so when they project out into the future, you can get things wildly wrong and we have a history of you, you know, look back through the predicted energy use of all sorts of new [00:23:00] technologies over the, um, decades or, you know, centuries. Then you’ll see predictions that were just crazy in hindsight.
We’re really early in the AI thing, so algorithms are gonna be refined. Um, chip designs are gonna be refined. Even, you know, like everything else around data center’s gonna be refined. Maybe quantum computing is gonna make a difference in a few years. You know, like maybe something that hasn’t been invented yet.
You know, like five years ago people didn’t think AI would be doing what it is today. There’ll be some other technology in five years that’s doing something that we couldn’t foresee. Um, so I, you know, I think that it’s more likely that the. Unexpected technology developments are on the side of bringing down the amount of power.
Allen Hall: Yeah. But the way that tends to go in industry is once you’re on a pathway, there’s very little that’s gonna deter you off that pathway. So even if there are significant improvements, you’ll see the main path still be followed. And that’s gonna be the trouble with these AI data centers, is that they’re gonna [00:24:00] project out, they’re gonna get their.
Mindset about doing it a certain way, and they’re gonna go, and if you talk about saving 10% here or there, they’re like, if it’s gonna take 10 more weeks to get that done, we’re not gonna do it. We’re gonna continue down this pathway.
Rosemary Barnes: No, but they’re doing it all the time. They heard about a, a data center, it was designed and, um, you know, planned for a certain amount of compute, and then the chip designs improved and they totally changed it.
And so now it, you know, it’s the same power, but it, um, processes much more. And we’re gonna. We’re gonna say a lot. A lot of that I think.
Allen Hall: I think the chat GPT usage and the AI usage is relatively low, and I know US engineers like to use those services because we like the new tech and we want to be involving our fingers in it and see what it’s all about.
I think the vast majority of humanity really hasn’t touched it yet. When they do, it’s gonna go
Joel Saxum: crazy. Did you see that Google’s alphabet stock? When they, they just released a, they did, it was an earnings report, but they released the end. This is the first time that their number of search engine [00:25:00] entries, whatever requests.
Dropped and it’s because, because, and their stock dropped by 10% that day that happened. Yeah. Like that’s, and and, and like you said, we, people that are in the know are using, I use it all day long. Right. My, uh, my partner uses it all day long, but the general populace hasn’t gotten into it yet. But once they do, it’s.
It’s so much better than Google, so much better than Google. Like you don’t have to know how to Google things anymore. You could just like ask a question that you’re talking to a person and it just gives you the answer,
Allen Hall: right? It is much more, uh, interactive, human, interactive, uh, interface than what Google ever was, and you still have to have little tricks to get Google to give you the right answer at times.
This is much more intuitive and if you think about your phone and how you try to Google things on your phone, it’s that interface is terrible. Absolutely terrible. It’s been terrible for five plus years. This AI interface, all of them, perplexity is the one that [00:26:00] I like at the minute, is really simple. It’s like asking somebody a question, like asking a librarian in the old days, where can I find this information?
Tell me what’s going on. Poof. There it is. And it provides justification, rationale behind it, all those kind of things you like to have as an engineer. But I do think the growth of this, if it is as powerful as it is today, the growth is gonna be phenomenal. And the power usage is gonna be nuts,
Rosemary Barnes: but I’m not sure that you are, um, aware of how much growth is baked into the forecast currently.
I’ve just brought up, um, an article that Michael Lere wrote on Bloomberg, NEF, um, about ai. And it, it’s interesting there because he goes through the economics of it, um, and he draws on some, uh. Questions that a guy David Kahn made, um, from Sequoia Capital that he says, David Kahn says that to justify the capital expenditures applied by NVIDIA’s [00:27:00] near term revenue pipeline, they would need to generate annual revenue from AI services of 200 billion.
And then, um, with their new updated NVIDIA sales forecast storing it, it’s been updated to 600 billion. Um, and that is, uh, yeah, like half of the aggregate revenue of Amazon, Microsoft Meta and Google Parent Alpha. So if you assume 600 billions will be, um, uh, it’ll be the world’s 100 million wealthiest people, then that’s $6,000 a year.
Um, and then, you know, like, obviously you can go a bit further down, but it, it’s um, like not impossible, but it’s also, that is a massive amount of growth that is already. Factored into the, that pipeline. So I think, I just think it’s more evidence that that is a, like a, that is a pretty optimistic take on, you know, immense growth and that it’s far more likely we’re gonna see less, less growth than that.
I still think we’re gonna see crazy growth, but. I think that the, [00:28:00] that the, the current pipeline that the, you know, current investments, if you, um, sorry, not investments, but the current plans for, for growth of companies like nvidia, they don’t just factor in incredible growth. It’s like incredible squared, incredible cubed growth that’s factored into their pipeline and it is gonna.
Scale, scale back again that I, I don’t think anyone can know, but that’s, that’s, I really think that that’s the most likely thing to happen.
Allen Hall: Building chips and building power plants are two wildly different things in terms of the time it takes to do it. Building a gigawatt of energy production takes time.
Building another chip is just clunk. There’s another one. It doesn’t take that much time. So I think the ability to create the chips is gonna far exceed the ability to power them.
Rosemary Barnes: Yeah, and that’s why you see like that project I talked about where they um, you know, the chip capability changed so much in between when they started the project and by the time they went to actually put the chips inside the building.
Um. You still see the power [00:29:00] stayed the same, but just the compute in increased. Um, so yeah, I think you’re right.
Joel Saxum: I still think that the, the good play is investing in a cable lay vessel. I’m telling you the the, the s the SF uptime cable lay vessel.
Allen Hall: This is my wild conspiracy theory at the moment, is that Elon with his satellite network, SpaceX and starlink and all that, allows you to put an AI center anywhere on the planet that it is cheap to power it.
Joel Saxum: A handful of geostationary satellites. Is and And if you devote them to one data center or to a family of data centers, somewhere that has to be cheaper than laying cables across the OS. Ocean.
Allen Hall: Yes, that’s what I’m saying. Elon’s gonna buy the center of Australia, lay out solar panels. Too hot. It’s gotta go somewhere cold.
I’m talking
Joel Saxum: Canada Green. Greenland. Greenland,
Allen Hall: [00:30:00] Greenland. Greenland. There you go. There’s a perfect conspiracy case right there, Joel. You hit all the triggers at one time. Well, well, we’re, we’re not gonna solve this this week. Uh, but it is an important issue and it is coming up a lot. And I know that it is not gonna stop the discussion.
It is ramping up and there’s a lot of energy being spent trying to figure out, can we even solve this problem? What’s happening with the IRA bill or the potential changes to the IRA bill can aggravate this and make it a lot harder. Uh, be prepared. Very interesting times. Joel Rosemary. Another great episode
Rosemary Barnes: and un unsupervised today.
I often wonder if these ones where we don’t have producer Claire here, um, you know, reigning us in, do we lose subscribers on these episodes or are people, you know, like really attracted to our tell it like it is, uh, kind of rambling, rambling style on these ones.
Allen Hall: Stay tuned and we’ll see you all here next week on the Uptime Wind Energy [00:31:00] Podcast.
https://weatherguardwind.com/vestas-lm-factory-data-centers/
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