When it comes to the most important thing to curb climate change – moving away from planet-heating fossil fuels – governments have done enough negotiating, and their focus now should be on putting what they already agreed into practice, Brazil’s COP30 president told Climate Home.

That does not require repeating language in new UN texts or even consensus among countries about how to transition from coal, oil and gas, although they could choose to design a roadmap for that energy shift at this year’s climate summit in the Amazon, André Aranha Corrêa do Lago said in an exclusive interview.

“We’ve all already decided that we’re going to transition away from fossil fuels. What can be done in the negotiations is, for example, to decide that there will be a timeline or rules for how this transition will be made – whether it will be one type of country or another, which of the fossil fuels will come first etc,” he said, speaking in Spanish on a video call from Rio de Janeiro.

The comments from Brazil’s top climate diplomat, who is vice-minister for climate, energy and environment at the Ministry of Foreign Affairs, build on a proposal floated by the country’s environment minister last month in response to a question from Climate Home.

Brazil’s environment minister suggests roadmap to end fossil fuels at COP30

Speaking to journalists in London, Marina Silva said COP30 could result in a roadmap setting out what a “planned and just transition to end fossil fuels” – as agreed at the COP28 Dubai summit in 2023 – should look like.

“Perhaps we can come out of COP30 with a mandated group that can trace the roadmap for this transition,” she added.

Corrêa do Lago noted in the interview that Silva “left it open in her statement whether [a roadmap] will be something negotiated or something that will be built”, adding that “several countries” believe such a plan would first require a formal COP decision to produce one.

The COP30 president emphasised that while this is up to governments, “we can’t keep the world waiting for negotiations to move forward” before acting to transition away from fossil fuels in energy systems.

“It’s not true that it depends on that. There’s already enough approval from countries. Individual countries can do it because implementation isn’t by consensus. Implementation is that each country does what it thinks it can do,” he explained.

The UN Secretary-General and many researchers have argued that implementing the energy transition in a “just, orderly and equitable manner” requires industrialised countries which are historically the biggest carbon polluters to move first in cutting fossil fuels, with developing countries that need to tackle poverty and a lack of energy access following later.

Brazilian officials, for example, when asked about recent auctioning of oil exploration licences have said that global demand for oil is still increasing – and there is a need to debate how to move away from this and other polluting fuels in a fair and organised way.

COP to stay in Belém despite tricky logistics

Brazil has grabbed the spotlight, for both positive and negative reasons, for deciding to hold the annual UN climate summit in the Amazon region, whose forests store massive amounts of carbon but are constantly under threat of being cut down for timber, agriculture or mining.

Corrêa do Lago said President Lula’s “original idea, the symbolism of holding [COP30] in the Amazon, remains very strong” – and he rebutted the idea that part or all of the climate conference could be moved from the Amazon city of Belém due to growing concern about a lack of suitable and affordable accommodation for the more than 50,000 delegates expected there.

The climate negotiations veteran conceded that there had been “several requests and suggestions” about shifting the main talks to bigger and more accessible cities such as Rio de Janeiro – a hotly debated topic in the Brazilian press.

“But the decision is to do it in the best possible way – that is very well, in Belém,” he said.

He added that a long-awaited official online platform to help participants find reasonably priced accommodation in the city is due to be launched on July 15 and he expected more apartments would be made available for rent.

At June’s mid-year talks in Bonn, African nations, small island states and the least-developed countries said they had written to the COP30 presidency warning they might not be able to attend the negotiations due to the high cost of lodgings and travel.

“Regarding the management of hotels and rooms, there has been a positive reaction from the authorities and local population,” Corrêa do Lago said. “Soon, people will realise that the situation is much better than they imagined and that they will want to come.”

This week, the COP30 team announced that construction to expand and improve the Outeiro Port Terminal – where two cruise ships will house around 6,000 delegates – would be completed by mid-October.

Pessimistic outlook for public climate finance

Another pressing issue for negotiators once they reach Belém is where to find more money for climate action in developing countries, to meet the new 2035 goal agreed in Baku last year.

After tense talks, which almost collapsed over the amount rich countries were prepared to put on the table, two key targets were set: $1.3 trillion a year from all public and private sources, including $300 billion raised by donor governments.

Developing countries wanted far more of the headline $1.3 trillion to be public money provided as grants and cheap loans. But Corrêa do Lago said this was unlikely to happen.

“We need to explain the limits of the funds, of multilateral cooperation, and where this money can really come from,” he told Climate Home.

The COP30 and COP29 presidencies are currently working on a roadmap that will outline ways to deliver $1.3 trillion annually in climate finance by 2035, with input requested from finance ministers.

UN expects climate finance roadmap to offer “clear next steps”

The COP30 president said this report – due to be published before the Belém talks – would be “independent”, without “legal value”, and would serve as a basis for further discussions among governments. He emphasised that national needs for finance will vary – and some countries will require more public funding than others depending on how they are viewed by private investors.

Still, he warned against the “huge simplification” that even the core $300-billion climate finance goal could be met entirely from public funding, “especially in the context where a wealthy country has withdrawn and other rich countries are investing in defence”.

The United States under fossil fuel-enthusiast Donald Trump has given notice it will withdraw from the 2015 Paris Agreement to tackle climate change and has cut off most development aid and climate funding for poorer countries.

While the US technically remains part of the Paris pact until January 2026, and has not quit the underlying UN climate convention, Corrêa do Lago said his team had yet to receive any indication of whether the US government will attend COP30.

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COP30 president: Transition from fossil fuels can start without climate talks