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IntoMachines: Smarter Turbine Bolt Tensioning
Martin Kristelijn, the co-founder of IntoMachines, discusses innovative tools designed to make bolt tensioning faster, safer, and less expensive. The conversation highlights the challenges of manually tensioning thousands of bolts, the advantages of automated bolt tensioning for wind turbines, and the development of a weightless, more efficient tensioning system.
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Sign up now for Uptime Tech News, our weekly email update on all things wind technology. This episode is sponsored by Weather Guard Lightning Tech. Learn more about Weather Guard’s StrikeTape Wind Turbine LPS retrofit. Follow the show on Facebook, YouTube, Twitter, Linkedin and visit Weather Guard on the web. And subscribe to Rosemary Barnes’ YouTube channel here. Have a question we can answer on the show? Email us!
Allen Hall: With wind turbines growing larger and bolts getting bigger, the industry needs smarter ways to handle critical bolted connections. This week we speak with Martin Kristelijn co-founder of IntoMachines. IntoMachines has developed unique tools that make bolt tensioning faster, safer, and much less expensive.
Welcome to Uptime, spotlight, shining light on wind. Energy’s brightest innovators. This is the Progress Powering tomorrow.
Allen Hall: Martin, welcome to. To the Uptime Wind Energy Podcast Spotlight.
Martin Kristelijn: Thank you. Glad to be here.
Allen Hall: Martin, there’s a big problem out in the field that we have a lot of bolts to tension and not a lot of people to go do it. Plus I think as you and I had discussed previously, the bolt sizers are getting much bigger.
Everything is becoming heavier and just being very difficult to do into machines changes all that. But let’s talk about the problem first. What are you seeing on factory lines and out in service as people try to tension bolts.
Martin Kristelijn: Past couple of months, year, I would say we spoke to a lot of people visited wind turbines, went in the field, see our technicians tighten the bolts also to the factories, so Elle production you name it.
And well, the, we kept on keeping getting the same feedback over and over. That they would like to speed up the bolting process and also that they would like to increase the quality, so to prevent any loose bolts or forgotten bolts. That was really the starting point for us. We started to focus on bolt tensioning, to automate it, to speed it up, and to increase the quality.
Allen Hall: So tensioning is the way going forward. A lot of of us remember torquing as being the preferred method to tighten bolts, but tensioning is now the way you wanna describe why that is?
Martin Kristelijn: Yeah, still it depends on who you ask, but the main objective for everyone usually is to get a maintenance free building connection, right?
That you keep the maintenance cost as low as possible. So that’s also our goal. And bolt tensioning for us is the most yeah. Convenient way forward to reach that.
Allen Hall: It’s the most consistent way too, right? Is that with torquing, we really don’t know what the preload is on the bolt. That’s why engineers are preferring tension tools instead of torquing tools now.
Martin Kristelijn: Exactly. So with torquing you have a friction coefficient you need to take into account. That’s an unpredictable. Value parameter. So you would like to get rid of that. And you do that by just grabbing the bolt itself, apply hydraulic pressure and stretch the bolt directly. And then you have your hydraulic pressure times the surface of your tension to, and that gives you exactly the the preload in your bolt and you tighten the nut, release the pressure, and your bolt is perfectly pretense.
As simple as that,
Allen Hall: right? So that process takes time to do. And if you have a factory worker or a technician doing tensioning to a lot of bolts of which there are thousands on a wind turbine but there’s probably what, a couple hundred that are critical.
Martin Kristelijn: Yeah. So around, give or take, 600 bolts critical bolted connections in a wind turbine.
And imagine that I said tightening the nut by hand. You have a wrench wrenching each of those 600 bolts. Then you have your pull bar. You need to thread that onto your bolt as well, or bolt stop bolt. Yeah, I can tell you that you don’t want to do that all day by hand.
Allen Hall: So how does that work right now in, in the factories?
If they’re doing it by hand? Is it are they changing people at that station because it just has to wear you out? Those bolts are big and that technique of tensioning manually is tiresome, right?
Martin Kristelijn: Yeah, exactly. We visited some factories as well and also the installation sites. And the feedback we got is that people they hurt their arm.
And not after the 10 bolt, not after the a hundred bolt maybe. But after a thousand volts your arm really starts to hurt. And yeah. That’s not good for your workforce, right? People need to be happy they need to be coming to work with a smile and we try to, to accomplish that by automating this this job.
Allen Hall: Joel, if I had a tension a thousand bolts a day on Monday, I don’t, not sure. I would be going back on Tuesday, would you?
Joel Saxum: No. And I think of that on Saturday and Sunday. I’m definitely trying to get as much rest as possible. But if you, but you make this a little bit more, think about the complication here is because as the global fleet.
Grows. Okay. The conversation we just had was about in the factory in a controlled setting. That’s one thing, right? Like you can have these into machines like it, it’s a good size tool. There’s a lot of weight there. There’s, you have the classical tensioning tools, like that’s.
It’s all hydraulic, like there’s a lot of things, but it’s controlled because you’re in a factory, at least you have decent conditions to work in. Even now, see the fleet grow and see what the, the projections are for how many wind turbines are gonna be installed over the next 2, 5, 10, 20 years globally.
This is a problem that you guys are solving for people in the field in a big way, and that’s the important part for me, when I talk to technicians and I talk to people in the field. You’re lugging this equipment, it’s the classical equipment. You’re lugging it up there and you’re doing this and it’s strain and drain on the body.
And then we know that’s when the body gets worn down, then the mind gets worn down and that’s when HSE in incidents happen and we’re trying to reduce all of those things. That’s what you guys are working on. When someone goes into the field with this kit what are you guys seeing for the change in the operators or the change in the technicians?
Are they, do they have a big smile on their face when they see something like this?
Martin Kristelijn: Yeah. They, at least when we see them with our stuff in their hands, then they smile a lot. Yes. But no the bottom line is that the, this tool says, so for 42 attention tool, you are looking at 1520 kilograms.
With some electric motors on it, and that goes up to 50 kilograms or 60 for M 72 tensioner.
Allen Hall: That’s a hundred pounds Joel in America. That’s a very heavy tool.
Martin Kristelijn: Yeah. So you need to carry that along, let’s say 150 bolts in a flinch, and that’s one flange. Exactly. Yeah.
Joel Saxum: Yeah. And so like you, you go to an onshore turbine, say even your flange bolts, you have bolts on the foundation, then you have.
A lot of times, four to five tower sections, those all have to be bolted together.
Martin Kristelijn: Yeah. Something like that. Yeah.
Joel Saxum: Yeah. And now, and then you talk up in the nelle and you’re, you have the blade bolts that have to get attention and all kinds of things. So like you said, 600 different connections that need to be worked on.
So that was
Martin Kristelijn: Let’s say our starting point heavy tooling. And we thought, okay, how can we make these tools weightless for the operators and move them fast from one ball to the other? Because that’s also a thing you need to move it fast from one bolt to the other to complete your 150 bolts in time because in the end before dark, you want to go home, you need to finish the bolt bolts.
So what we did there is we designed a very specific lift trolley. It’s very low and compact, very lightweight as well. So you should have let’s say less problems with passing obstacles. For example, you have the stairs in the wind turbine and due to our low trolley design, it usually should go underneath the stairs.
So you’re not bothered by that. And it makes attention to weightless. If you combine. That literally with the automated tensioning tool we made. Yeah. Then you have an unbeatable system.
Allen Hall: Yeah. So that’s what in two machines has done, and your team over there are mechanical geniuses. You actually make the tension tool quasi weightless by using mechanical means.
So you’ve designed. Very smart systems tools in which the tension tool adapts into to make it so much easier to do. And we’re gonna put some of these tensioning tool improvement devices, I’ll call them on the YouTube version so people can see them. But the simplest version of this is the trolley.
And maybe Martin, you can describe what this thing is because. It’s a little hard to see. We’ll put it on YouTube, obviously. But for those listening, what does the trolley do in terms of the tensioning unit?
Martin Kristelijn: First of all it needs to operate in a very r rugged environment as a wind turbine.
So it needs to be super, super simple. It needs to be super robust and easy to maintain. We took, design. It’s made of steel, galvanized steel, so you can hit it with a hammer and it should still work. Then we made some nice interface brackets that you can just hang your attention to in the trolley.
Okay, and we have just a very simple gas spring, which compensates the weight of the tension tool.
Allen Hall: Okay? So now when you’re putting together tower sections, if you have this trolley that’s holding the tension tool, and so the technician is just using almost no force to lift the tension tool, make the tension tool do its thing and move it to the next bolt.
That I’ve watched that tool on your LinkedIn page, it is quite remarkable how fast that tool is. Just by making it more mobile and taking some of the weight away from the technician, that technician is much more productive.
Martin Kristelijn: Yeah, absolutely. If you have the trolley and then you have our smart tensioning system it is motorized.
So the tension tool comes from our partner Tension Pro. They’re very good at making tension tools. So we partnered up with them and we said, Hey, let’s make a kick ass product which we call the quantum Smart Tensioner. So they are very good at making tensioners. We are very good in developing user-friendly software and mechatronics.
So electric motors put that all together in the quantum system. And the basis for the quantum system, again, is a super robust system. Easy to maintain, easy to operate, and it yeah, no bells and whistles, let’s say. And so you don’t want it to break down. It needs to be a usable for practical people.
Let’s say, Ellen, if I take you in a wind turbine, I want to give you our quantum system. I will give you a 15 minute explanation, and then it’s so easy to operate that you can do the bolting works for us.
Allen Hall: Wow, that’s impressive because I’m probably not very good at that job. Martin, that Martin, that’s a big task you just took on.
But I have watched it. I’ve watched your videos and I do think I could do it.
Martin Kristelijn: I think so too, because I really believe in our content. Quantum system, so I really think you could do it for us.
Allen Hall: That tool is universal. It can be used in any tower, essentially anywhere. To speed up that process to get bolts, tensioned, and have all the quality data that you need, and to know that tower section has been properly installed now.
I’ve seen some more advancements on LinkedIn. I saw this little robot that was crawling around doing bolt tensioning, and it just blew my mind and that’s why I reached out to you like, whoa, okay, this is life altering for people. You wanna explain what that next generation is from the trolley up to this sort of crawling robot tensioning tool?
Martin Kristelijn: Yeah, absolutely. So our vision for the bold tensioning markets is that we want to speed up the process. To tension all those bolts quicker for the coming turbines and also to prevent any loose bolts. You do that by documenting each bolted connection. So we register the pressure, we register the nut angle, we register at the nut torque, we register the boat number.
All that stuff is nicely registered in a A PDF document. However if you can speed it up even more by using a robotic system, that’s our end goal. At the moment we are developing a autonomous bolt tensioning robot for blade bolts. So it’s it’s working in an cell factory there.
It’s just crawling around the hip. Tensioning all the bolts one by one. And then we develop we develop the quantum system in such a way that for the near future, let’s say yeah, coming year you can have the quantum system with a literally, and then a technician will operate it.
But that same quantum smart tensioner in one year, if we’ve launched the robot for, field usage. You can place that same quantum smart tensioner inside our robot and have a fully automated and autonomous bolt tensioning system.
Joel Saxum: I think an important thing to touch on here, Martin, is what the developments that you guys are doing.
We, when we said it earlier you’re experts in software, me and mechatronics. I’ve been around the robotics industry in wind, in oil and gas and sub-C, oil and gas. The best pieces of kit that come out that do that automated process or automate a task are ones like exactly like in two machines has created here that are robust and simple to operate.
There’s way too many tools out there that require a software engineer to be on site to do these things, right? Like when autonomous drones first came out for inspections in turbines. You would see three people at the base of the turbine and two of those people were literally software engineers, like going through code and fixing things and people got a little bit turned off by ’em ah, I can’t be doing this.
Or, I’ve been on sub c oil and gas projects before where you gotta. Fly an ROV technician, a mechatronics expert in from Norway for $2,500 a day to solve this problem that’s happening in Nigeria. Like you can’t have that, like that. That is a barrier to entry for robotics in this space.
You guys have taken the leap past that you’ve made it simple. You’ve made it robust, you’ve made it tough. You’ve made it so that people can operate these things without having a, a year long training course, and that you guys don’t have to be there to do it for them. So I think that’s one of the most important things to get across here for people that are listening, is if you want to make your operations more efficient in the field, if you want to have good data tracking for the tension that you’ve done.
Into machines has done the hard work, they’ve done the legwork to get to that stage. So I guess a question for you then, Martin, is what does it look like? What’s your track record in the field? How many of these things, how many bolts have you guys tensioned? What does it look like?
Martin Kristelijn: I have to say the product has launched quite recently.
We have several customers that say who are using the system. And the feedback we get back from them is indeed yeah, compared to what they had is that it’s faster and easier to operate, but also that we and that’s very difficult to have to say that we don’t have a lot of sensors. We don’t have difficult software.
So it’s all straightforward to operate what I said with 15 minutes, I can teach Alan how to tension a flinch altogether with the quantum system. Yeah we really went back to basic. We stripped all the unnecessary stuff from it, which could break down. We took it off and only the bare minimum we kept such that the guys in the field that they need to use it every day, that they’re also happy to use it.
And indeed they don’t need to read the user manual every day before they start a job. That’s not what we want.
Allen Hall: You must be the technician’s best friend after they use that tool for a day or two. They must love into machines.
Martin Kristelijn: Yeah. Yeah. We, yeah, actually we always say what I said, we always go go away with the smile from our turbines and the guys trying our our equipment as well.
So that’s always really good feedback.
Joel Saxum: I think there’s something to be said there too for the global problem that we have, I in, in the wind world is technician shortage, right? And so we’ve talked to Alan and I’ve talked to quite a few people working in this space. How do we tackle this problem?
How can we get more training, get more people in here? One of the things that we can ensure that we can do is make it easier for the technicians in the field to get up to speed fast, to be able to get a task done without having to have five years of experience to figure out how to do it. So now you can bring someone that’s fairly green to the industry.
They’ve got their safety certifications. They know what they’re doing. They know their way around a turbine, but now they can be. The torque or the, I would say the torque tensioning technician, but I’ll say the tensioning tech technician. But they can do it in a relatively short amount of time, so that helps the overall industry and or, an ISP or an EPC contract or whatever it is, scale their workforce up faster to get more projects done.
With high quality at speed, and that’s what we want. That’s the, you guys are doing, you’re doing the hard work, the heavy lifting for the industry.
Martin Kristelijn: Yeah. That was for us also one key factor to make this thing work. Because what I said, we are a relatively new player into machines is now five years old.
And yeah, we set together with tension problem. We said, okay, in order to make this work. It’s you should be operated, be able to operate it within that 15 minutes and maybe, okay, maybe it takes you half an hour, but then you really are up to speed with the system and you yeah you just can go for it.
So speed is really really important for us.
Allen Hall: So where is in two machines at, on the planet at the moment? I know you’re all over Europe. Are you in the States? Are you in Australia or are you in South America?
Martin Kristelijn: Our office is based in the Netherlands. So that, that’s Europe. Then we have some systems in Europe itself.
We have some systems in Asia, and we’re now looking in looking for the US So we have some, some talks there to to launch the product.
Allen Hall: I could see a lot of opportunity in the United States, and Joel and I have been to some of those places and watched bolts being assembled manually.
It just seemed like an arduous process. And because I, I think a lot of operators have not seen you in, a lot of technicians haven’t seen you. They need to get to your website and check this out. Where do they go?
Martin Kristelijn: The first thing they go is to into machines.com. That I see some product videos of us had to get a feel of how it looks, how it works, the products.
So the lift trolleys the quantum system, quantum Smart Tensioner, as well as the fully autonomous tensioning robot. And we have a very active LinkedIn page into machines where you can see also videos inside wind turbines where we have the trolleys. The lift rolls and also the robots jumping around on a flinch.
So that’s that’s the stuff you want to see.
Allen Hall: Martin, if I wanna demo one of your robotic assistants and make tensioning so much easier, how do I do that? Can I get my hands on the tool to try it out?
Martin Kristelijn: Yeah, you can. So the first thing you do or you can do is send us an email sales@intomachines.com.
Then we we’ll arrange, a demo for you and the second is send us a DM on the link LinkedIn page. Then we we’ll also organize a demo and an online call to answer all the questions.
Allen Hall: And once you try it, you’re going to want to buy it because that tool is gonna save you a tremendous amount of time.
And so you need to check out into machines.com if you wanna see all the wonderful things that Martin and his team has designed. Martin, you’re always coming up with really cool ideas and putting ’em into action and saving the wind industry. Tremendous amount of labor and time and effort in making the job simpler, which is what we need to do.
So congratulations, really good tools.
Martin Kristelijn: Thank you very much for that.
Allen Hall: And thanks for being on the podcast. We love having you on.
Martin Kristelijn: Yeah, I also loved speaking to you about about these topics. Really nice.
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The hosts cover some recent turbine failures, Onyx Insight’s new CEO and strategic acquisitions, research about wind turbine farmland contracts, and an article about hybrid brakes by Dellner.
Sign up now for Uptime Tech News, our weekly email update on all things wind technology. This episode is sponsored by Weather Guard Lightning Tech. Learn more about Weather Guard’s StrikeTape Wind Turbine LPS retrofit. Follow the show on Facebook, YouTube, Twitter, Linkedin and visit Weather Guard on the web. And subscribe to Rosemary Barnes’ YouTube channel here. Have a question we can answer on the show? Email us!
You are listening to the Uptime Wind Energy Podcast brought to you by build turbines.com. Learn, train, and be a part of the Clean Energy Revolution. Visit build turbines.com today. Now here’s your hosts, Allen Hall, Joel Saxon, Phil Totaro, and Rosemary Barnes.
Allen Hall: Welcome to the Uptime Wind Energy Podcast. I’m your host, Alan Hall in the Queen city of Charlotte, North Carolina.
Rosemary Barnes in Australia and Joel Saxon in the great state of Texas. Just before we hopped online to record this podcast, Rosemary was telling us about a number of turbine problems on LinkedIn and. Rosemary wanted to comment on them. These are some of the larger turbines. Rosemary are newer turbines.
Uh, some of them onshore, some of ’em offshore
Rosemary Barnes: for the, yeah, for the most part. Um, yeah, both onshore and offshore. Some a little bit older, but the common thread is, um, [00:01:00] just like spectacular fail failures of multiple blades of one across multiple turbines of one, the one I saw most recently. Had blades smashed to pieces.
It had towers that had just like fallen apart. Like it was, um, like they weren’t bolted together. Like it was just blocks stacked on top of each other and they had, you know, just an angry baby had just topped them over. That’s what it looked like. And um, I think what’s really interesting is reading the comments in those and it just, without fail every single time, the first few comments are gonna be.
Um, justifying how that is just cool and normal, like either by the company itself or the turbine manufacturer itself saying, oh, you know, oh, this was just a prototype. So, you know, it doesn’t matter that it fell apart, like. Forgetting about the fact that, okay, it’s just a prototype, but it’s still an operational turbine that people would’ve been inside it to install it.
They’re inside it to maintain it. You know, people are inside those things. They’re not supposed to be able to just fall apart by the time that it gets to that point.
Joel Saxum: I, I, I think I’ve seen some of these same posts, Rosemary, and one of the ones that I saw recently [00:02:00] was not even, it wasn’t new, it wasn’t prototypes.
It was, it was like, there’s a picture, there’s three turbines with, or four turbines and there of the, of the dozen blades in the picture, nine of them are gone. It’s just a nelle hub with like little stubs on three turbines, and those are only like 850 kilowatt, one megawatt, 1.5 megawatt machines. They’re, they’re old.
Rosemary Barnes: Yeah. Yeah. And so I think a typhoon went through in that particular case and I made a comment, you know, like it’s either poor turbine design or it’s really poor site assessment. In either case, it’s a failure, right? Like you don’t put wind turbines that can’t withstand a typhoon in a place that gets typhoons.
Um, but you always, you always say people saying how this is actually great engineering. And I just thought this is just the classic example of that, um, that was written under this latest post, and I’ll just read it out. The pictures point to the designers of these turbines. Having done that, designing to a certain wind speed, having done that to a high degree of consistency, I note three failure types [00:03:00] in the pictures, blade snap, tower, buckling and bolt failure, pointing to all parts, having been designed to the same survival.
Wind speed looks like they did their job well. And it’s just like, oh, what, you look at this, at this path of like it’s Godzilla has run through this wind farm, and you’re like, oh yeah, that looks like a job done. Well, well done guys. It’s just like, if we can’t learn anything as an industry from these kinds of things, then, you know, how can we expect to have a, a bright future for the industry?
Like it? It’s one thing to fail, but if you look at a failure and say, that’s actually a success that is. Just the worst possible outcome we have. We have to be able to say what went wrong, what do we do to make sure this doesn’t happen again? You have to. You have to learn, otherwise you’re going backwards.
Allen Hall: Are you worried about unexpected blade root failures and the high cost of repairs? Meet eco Pitch by Onyx Insight. The standard in blade root monitoring. Onyx state-of-the-art sensor tracks blade root movement in real [00:04:00] time, delivering continuous data to keep your wind farm running smoothly and efficiently.
With Eco Pitch, you can catch problems early, saving hundreds of thousands of dollars. Field tested on over 3000 blades. It’s proven reliability at your fingertips. Choose eco Pitch for peace of mind. Contact Onyx Insight today. To schedule your demo of Eco Pitch and Experience the future of Blade Monitoring, there’s been a series of leadership transitions that is really changing the face of the wind industry.
Onyx Insight. The Macquarie Capital Back Condition monitoring specialist who’ve had in the podcast, um, has appointed Alexis Grennan as this new chief executive officer Alexis Bringss dearly 20 years of experience from Joel. Schneider Electric where he most recently served as CEO of the digital grid division, and his expertise in smart grid software solutions and energy management systems positioned him to lead [00:05:00] Onyx Insights expansion beyond its current 28,000 wind turbines under monitoring across 35 countries.
So obviously Onyx is a big provider of CMS systems. They are the sole provider of CMS systems on GE turbines at the minute. Onyx is making a lot of moves. They just acquired 11 I recently also. So they’re, uh, what it looks like right now. They wanna be the, the leader in CMS.
Joel Saxum: Yeah, I think it’s, if you go deeper into their history a bit.
You know, the couple of CMS solutions around gearbox was really where they started then. Then they got to the eco pitch thing, and then now the blevin. And I think if you’re sitting in that boardroom, you’re thinking they want to be the center hub for IO ot, IOT being sensors out in the field. Anything that comes in, they want to be able to amalgamate it and help people out in that direction.
Um, you know, a new, a new CEO that has, uh, 20 years at Schneider [00:06:00]with digital grid. That’s awesome. Right? Good hire there. I would think. Um, I, I do see this as a trend in wind. You’re seeing some more CEOs and senior leadership coming into organizations from outside of wind directly. Some of the bigger capital holders, you know, the Goldmans of the world and the Macquarie’s and that kind of things, if they have portfolio companies, you’re seeing people be placed in leadership roles that are coming from outside of wind and bringing expertise from, of course, usually energy, software, supply chain, these kind of things that we need, but some fresh blood at the leadership level.
I like to see that.
Allen Hall: Well, the addition of the grid coming into Onyx, is that an expansion plan? Because there is a lot of work going on expanding the grid and monitoring the grid and making the grid carry more energy than what it was originally designed for. And I’ve listened to a number of podcasts over the last month that talks specifically to it.
It, it is a definite growth area. [00:07:00] You think this could indicate a move into other areas besides just the basic wind? CMS. Solutions.
Joel Saxum: Well, let’s think about it this way. So in wind, when you have wind specific companies, you’re starting to see intenders or you have been seen intenders for the last few years, even just the most basics inspections.
Okay? We’re inspecting blades. Use your RFP. Now those blades say, and blades plus BOP. So we want you to do the transmission lines. And then you’re seeing some of ’em that are BOP plus substations. So all the sub, all the way back to the edge of the wind farm where connects to the grid. Um, so companies are adjusting, like you’ve seen Skys specs adjust to that.
You, you know, whether it’s partnerships or expanding things internally and other companies as well, even down to the ISPs starting to do more and more and more because they’re being asked to. This makes sense because, uh, at the end of the day, if you’re working for a subset of customers, there’s only so much budget in.
Of turbine work and if you wanna expand your company and grow, you need to expand in other [00:08:00] areas. So why not just keep it going down the line of connection to the grid, inter, inter wind farm issues, those kind of things out of the wind farm. So I, I don’t know if that’s ON’S plan, but I can see that. I think that from a strategic standpoint, it makes sense.
Allen Hall: Well, as Schneider is involved in all kinds of aspects of the grid worldwide, so I would assume bringing in a new CEO would open up maybe some horizons to Onyx and maybe there’s adjacent businesses that they should be in because they have a lot of technology and they’re pretty smart group. They may want to expand outwin just a tiny bit just to, to test the waters, see what they could do there.
Well, going to solar seems like an obvious choice, but there could be other areas that they may want to look at, at least in the short term to see if they can add value.
Joel Saxum: Yeah. Grid infrastructure. Right. I think that that’s a, we talk about it regularly that our, our entire global grid is aging quickly. It’s aging fast, and with the changes coming [00:09:00] on board with.
You know, different generation types, all the batter, different types of battery storage, and you know, like our, our conversations with Joe Chicon over at Podge about, uh, frequencies on the grid and all these different changes and load changing and AI data centers coming up and on and off and on. Um, it’s really highlighting the need for a future digital grid, uh, and upgrades to it.
So Onyx is probably, you know, in the wind world that we see, they’re probably sitting pretty. In a pretty good spot as compared to most companies to be able to engage in that and bringing on someone from the digital grid side of Schneider. Smart move in my my opinion, I dunno. Rosie, what are your, what are your thoughts on that
Rosemary Barnes: in general?
I think it’s really good to move people around to similar industries or a little bit different, different roles. Uh, I think that that’s a, um, a real way to drive innovation forward by bringing in different perspectives. I know that I. I found myself appearing more innovative when I lived in Denmark. You know, just purely [00:10:00] because I had seen and experienced and done things in a different, a different way, solved similar problems in a different way.
Um, just, just through what I, you know, the kinds of engineers I worked with earlier in my career. It was different to the way that a lot of Danish people had been taught to approach problems. And it just, you know, when you bring in a few slightly different people, it really expands the um. Amount of options that you have on the table for solving new problems as they come up.
And all of these kinds of industries are doing stuff that hasn’t been done before, right? So I think you do want to have as many different options that you, as you can come up with to, um, end up with the good solutions and you’ll get more options if you don’t choose people that are all from the exact same background.
So I think in general, that, um, it’s always good to, to shake things up
Allen Hall: in this quarter’s PES Win magazine, there’s a lot of great articles that you. Need to read. And the way to do that is go to PS wind.com and download your free edition. [00:11:00] And we wanna talk about an article in the magazine this quarter, Joel, which is Hybrid Breaks Ya Breaks.
Why you would use ’em, why they’re, this is a little bit different than what we typically see on like a GE machine. Uh, Siemens GAA uses these quite a bit, which are sort of a passive and an active, so they’re a break. So there’s a hydraulic cylinders and there’s some active pads that close, but there’s also some static pads and they’re using slip rings instead of a, a bearing surface to rotate the jaw.
So if, if that makes sense. You to do an active system, uh, you can really put stress on your, on your ball bearings and probably flatten them over time if you keep squeezing enough. With this system, it’s a little more control, a little more precise. So you’re, I, I think the, the argument they’re making is that it, uh, simplifies the system, so there’s some complexities to it, but overall.
It costs less, [00:12:00] and that’s what we should be doing in engineering, right? Trying to figure out ways that maybe just cost a bit more for a component, but less overall.
Joel Saxum: Is it a direct retrofit? Like is this a, Hey, we’ve, we’ve had, we’ve had a component fail, so we want to put a new system in. Or is it like aix, swap it out now as a CapEx cost?
Or is it like during Repower, when are they putting this on?
Allen Hall: It’s from Donor Wind Solutions, uh, and they’re doing, doing it as part of OEM work, right? It, it does take a little bit of finite element analysis because of the way it loads up the, the yaw system. So you want to make sure that it doesn’t overload it if you’re gonna use it, but it’s one of those things in wind like, uh.
Try to choose a simpler system on a smaller turbine. As you get larger and larger, your approach probably changes. And this is what Ner is pointing out.
Joel Saxum: I’ve noticed that actually, if you’re, if you’ve frequented any wind conferences, technology shows, exhibitions, you will know where NER is because everything on their booth is lime green.[00:13:00]
Um, I love that. I think it’s a great approach, uh, which everybody knows. It’s, it’s like seeing the Dema, the Dema ships or the SVA ships in a port. You’re like, you know what? That one is right away. Uh, but del nor, but that’s what Nert does, right? They, they are. They have parts that are direct replacements.
Great. This is the part we’ve made it a little bit better, but it’s a direct replacement. But they also are re-engineering things, making them better, uh, for the long haul, uh, from a operations standpoint. ’cause I’ve seen some of their pitch, they have different kind of pitch systems and stuff as well that they are, are retrofits for, for, uh, specific machines that have trouble with them.
Um, but yeah, uh, this one to me, I’m not an expert on jaw brakes. Of course, that’s not my thing. Uh, but I do know that whenever you have to deal with that YA system, whether it be the gearing, the brakes, or the, you know, like the, the pucks and the GE go bad all the time. Like it’s an undertaking, uh, down to the point where people have developed UPT tower machining processes to fix, uh, issues with the YA system and whatnot.
So, um, if they’re, if, if someone is putting this [00:14:00] much engineering effort into fixing a problem, it’s definitely a problem.
Allen Hall: Yeah. Even think about the problem though, you have so much weight. Up into the cell and you’re trying to pivot all the time, and the wind is trying to move into the cell whether you want it to or not.
The YA system kind of takes all the abuse. So designing a system to last is really the key here. Without breaking things, I mean how many turbines have we seen where the YA gear teeth have been damaged or broken off? Because the brake system is not really de-stressing those teeth. It matters a lot. So as we get more and more efficient with wind turbines, we gonna be thinking about all the different components that go into a wind turbine and making them more efficient, making ’em last longer, making them cost less.
So if you haven’t downloaded the latest PES wind. Magazine do it. You can read this article from Donor. Just visit PS wind.com. As Wind Energy Professionals, staying informed is crucial, and let’s face it difficult. That’s why the Uptime [00:15:00] podcast recommends PES Wind Magazine. PES Wind offers a diverse range of in-depth articles and expert insights that dive into the most pressing issues facing our energy future.
Whether you’re an industry veteran or new. Wind, PES Wind has the high quality content you need. Don’t miss out. Visit PES wind.com today. Well in the US when a wind company wants to put some turbines on your farm, uh, the operator just talks to the, each farmer individually and negotiates a deal. Now a lot of those deals are very similar, but you may find from neighbor to neighbors, slight differences and farmers are getting.
Smarter over time. Clearly. Uh, a professor or assistant professor up at Purdue University in Purdue is in Indiana, kind of central part of the United States, explains that landowners can be paid up to $10,000 per acre annually [00:16:00]to lease to wind energy companies. And that’s a great amount of money. We’ll take that, but, and the turbines only occupy maybe one to three acres, and so you can continue to farm your several hundred acre parcel.
Uh, but. This professor notes that the farmers are starting to consider other factors than just the money, including the visual impact community relationships, which is the big one I think lately. And political beliefs about renewable energy, which jolt talks about all the time in Wisconsin. Uh. The advice from the professor is have an attorney to review the lease and to make sure that the wind operator is going to restore the land to its original condition once they stop using the turbines.
And I think that makes a ton of sense. So you’re seeing a slight shift in the way that landowners are coming to agreement with some of the operators. It is about the money, a large part of it, but they’re also trying to navigate the neighborhood situation where they don’t make their neighbors upset. You can imagine a lot of them have been there for generations and they don’t [00:17:00] want to really make the neighbors mad at ’em.
Uh, so you’re seeing a lot different types of leases coming about now than maybe you saw five years ago even. And that has evolved, uh, quite a bit. But the money is still good. I think most people, at least in the United States, most farmers will. Like to have that additional revenue. It just makes the farm much more profitable over time.
But that same situation doesn’t exist worldwide. And Rosie, are you seeing something different in Australia? It does seem like there’s a little more spreading of the wealth in, in terms of revenue.
Rosemary Barnes: I actually listened to a good podcast episode on this recently. Uh, it was the switched on, not the Bloomberg switched on, but the renew economy switched on.
Um, and they interviewed a now retired farmer who had, had one of the very early wind farms, um, in Australia, put on his farm. And I mean, his story was o overall very positive. It it, the [00:18:00] time when they started talking about it was during a very severe and prolonged drought in Australia and he had actually been trying to sell off land, um, just to keep the.
You know, keep the lights on, um, and was unable to sell. Like just there’s no buyers at any price at that time. And then, so the wind farm came and he, he also mentioned how important it’s to get, um, lawyers, good lawyers advising on the contract because he mentioned that he was getting paid every year before construction as well.
And that it ended up taking 10 or 14 years, I can’t remember the exact amount of time, but a long time. Between starting to talk about it and actually having the wind farm built. And if he hadn’t have had that, he said he wouldn’t have been able to make it. So, um, that was one thing. But yeah, so and so overall it was very positive for him.
He was eventually able to sell his farm and, and retire, um, nicely with a profitable farm. He also mentioned that he was able to do a lot of upgrades on the farm with the money, the revenue that was coming from the wind turbines. So when we went to sell, it had all new fences and, you know, stuff like that [00:19:00] that made it very attractive and easy to sell.
Um, but he also mentioned a few things that were just really bad, and he sounded really angry in that episode, um, where, uh, he, he said at that time it was like the wind developer knew everything and the farmers knew nothing, and they tried to keep it that way. Like he had a brother on a neighboring property was also in discussions about wind turbines, and they were forbidden from talking to each other.
I think that that’s a lesson that’s been learned over the last 10, 20 years in Australia, is that. It’s really worth it to put a bit of effort upfront in, um, listening to what people’s concerns are and then doing something about it. Uh, I think there’s been so much emphasis on like listening and talking and listening.
That’s not the important part. The important part is then understanding what the issues are and then, um, you know, removing those, those barriers. And, you know, money is a big part of that.
Joel Saxum: I spent. A eight plus years dealing with these issues in the field with landowners on, on oil and gas [00:20:00] projects, right?
So there’s stages of oil and gas projects from exploration to production and all these different things, and they, and everybody gets different lease payments and, and access payments along the way. And, and if you, you know, if someone has locked up your land in the seventies, you may only be getting five bucks.
And if someone has this, they’re getting more. It’s, and it, what ended up happening is, is. You need to, you need to, and we’re in the, we’re in the same space of wind because those same people, those same professionals, landmen and permit agents and stuff that worked in oil and gas work in wind and solar as well.
It’s the same companies. It’s the same ideas.
Allen Hall: Yeah. Same groups.
Joel Saxum: Yeah, same groups. Um, they, they need to distinguish and make sure they’re taking care of participating landowners and non-participating landowners. And the non-participating landowners, just like we’re talking about here, they’re just as important as the participating ones because they’re the ones you’re gonna piss off.
Uh, so, so you’re starting to see some payments going directly to them as well. Like if you’re within X amount of feet of a turbine, even if you’re not on your land, you are starting to get a little bit of a payment [00:21:00] in some areas, in some spots. Um, but one thing I wanna flag is, at the beginning of this, we talked about a lawyer, bringing a lawyer in and having them look at certain things.
I would say this and maybe the wind industry developers are gonna hate me for this. But there’s a legal, legal concentration called, um, a, a favored Nations clause or a most favored Nations clause. If you are a part of anything of this sort, make sure any, any signing, any contract for wind, uh, non-participating.
Participating. Make sure you have a clause like this in your contract because it will basically State wind Farm goes in a hundred turbines. If they’re offering you five bucks an acre and they’re offering your neighbor a thousand, you get a thousand too. It makes, it makes everybody equal in the playing field.
It doesn’t give anybody, uh, you know, better terms and conditions. Once one person gets a term and condition, that’s good, everybody gets it. That has that most favored nations clause in their contract. So have a lawyer institute that if you’re gonna be a part of one of these.
Allen Hall: Yeah. The other thing that was pointed out in the [00:22:00] article was, uh, a lack of increasing payments adjusted to inflation.
So some of the farmers are pushing back because inflation is relatively high. So if you got $10,000. Per acre per year in 2035, he may want to see something more like $15,000 per acre per year because of inflation. That to me makes a lot of sense, but I know a lot of leases don’t work like that. They’re just.
Fixed price. It’s today’s price and it stays that way until the end of the lease. It’s just simpler to do. There’s a lot less math to do. But Joel, as you see more, uh, farmers getting advice, taking advice, do you see this evolving into a more of a standard contract where they. Do have the favored nation.
They do have inflationary increases based on cost of living or some federal standard so that you’re, instead of having to negotiate every contract completely separate, you’re getting [00:23:00] something a little more universal, including helping the neighbors.
Joel Saxum: Yeah. The tough thing there is that a lot of wind.
Okay, so we’re like, I’m just gonna pick the United States example. You’re in different states, you’re in different counties, you’re in different areas, right? So if you go to Minnesota and you talk to someone in Minnesota about their mineral rights, they more than likely don’t know what you’re talking about.
Yeah, because that’s not a thing up there for most of Minnesota. Some of Minnesota is right, the Iron Range and whatnot, but if you talk to someone in Texas about mineral rights, that’s just as important or of more important than their actual real property surface rights. So they know and, and they have to build contracts around certain things the same way oil and gas contracts were like at oil and gas contracts at, you know, early days were easy.
It was X amount per acre. That’s it. Uh, now you have people buying strata and leasing strata out of, uh, subsurface things, and you have. Payments tied to payments tied to production, right? And I haven’t seen a whole lot of wind payments tied to production. I don’t know if that exists or solar, um, [00:24:00]that that can be a, you know, a shared upside or shared downside type thing.
Um, if someone’s gonna pay me $15,000 an acre, I’m just taking the cash. I don’t care what your production is ’cause that’s a great rate. So, so, um, you, you know, I think that. Using these organizations that have been doing this for a long time, that is a smart way to go if you’re an operator, uh, that know how to navigate the town halls and that know how to do these things professionally because there is actually just like you have to have a real estate license.
There is a professional landman license, uh, of, to do this kind of stuff. Uh, so there’s schooling, there’s certifications, all this. Again, I’m just talking in the United States here. Um, but, uh, I don’t know if I see a across the board. Federal type contract. ’cause it’s just too many municipalities, too much, too much going on.
Allen Hall: Well, we’ve been looking at a lot of wind farms the last couple of months on the lightning side and realizing, you know, how [00:25:00] dedicated the wind farm installations are to putting ’em on ridge lines, even if it’s a, a. A hundred feet higher. So that tends to spread out the wind farms. Unlike in some parts of Kansas where there isn’t a lot of variation in the, uh, in the surface in other places.
We’re just looking at Oklahoma, uh, where the turbines are specifically falling ridge lines. So you’re gonna end up crossing a lot of property lines when you do that, I assume. And you and I have been on a number of sites where. We’re going from one turbine to another and we’re crossing three or four different property owners and not that far of a distance.
Fences and gates. Right? The fences and gates. Bet. So even if you don’t have a turbine on your property, you may have a road on your property. And the how they navigate that. So if, if, if, if whoever’s. Taking on those contracts and negotiating on those contracts has a load of work to do. It’s going to be,
Joel Saxum: and like I like, I think I go back a little bit like it’s gonna be dependent on where you are, because a contract in Kansas is gonna look a lot different than a contract in Wyoming versus a contract in Texas just simply [00:26:00] because of local laws, access rights, these kind of things.
I’d say, I mean, however, one of the, that’s one of the things that’s cool to touch on is some of these farmers and ranchers, like when I was in oil and gas stations in Wyoming, they loved when the exploration crews came ’cause they would get money for roads. And they’d be like, oh, these old two tracks. Make that into a road that can take an 18 wheeler down then, then you can have access.
And they’re happy, happier than hell. This week’s Wind Farm of the Week is the Alta Complex owned by TerraGen out in California. So at one point in time, of course if you’re a part of wind lore in the United States. You know that this was the biggest wind farm in the United States at 1,550 megawatts. It was also the third largest onshore project worldwide.
Now there’s been a couple of the Sun Zia projects and stuff have been a bit bigger, but this thing is massive. Uh, spreads across about 9,000 acres and holds, hosts almost 600 turbine. Uh, so it started in 2010. Multiple phases of construction, uh, ended in 2014 and financed with almost $3 billion. [00:27:00]Uh, and it’s in that Tehachapi Pass area.
So, uh, it has, it actually still does have some capacity for expansion. Uh, but we wanted to share this one because, uh, just the size and scale of this thing, uh, being that it’s so big, uh, and as well. Long-term power purchase agreement signed with Southern California Edison. Uh, the output averages enough power to, to power about 450,000 homes annually, uh, which is just massive.
Uh, it’s created over 3000 jobs. And I think this one, the economic story might be the, the, the, the feather in the cap, uh, is it in his injects over $1 billion into the regional economy, which is just massive. So, uh, kudos to the wind industry for making this one happen. Uh, but looking ahead, uh, it is a bigger part of that Tehachapi wind resource area when it has the expan or has expansion potential of up to 10 gigawatts.
Uh, as California continues to grow out, its renewable grid. So this week’s wind farm, the Ulta Wind [00:28:00] Complex, so owned by TerraGen out there in California, the Wind Farm of the week.
Allen Hall: That wraps up another episode of the Uptime Wind Energy Podcast. Thanks for joining us. We appreciate all the feedback and support we receive.
From the wind industry. If today’s discussion sparked any questions or ideas, we’d love to hear from you. Just reach out to us on LinkedIn, particularly Rosemary, and please don’t forget to subscribe so you never miss an episode. So for Joel Rosemary, I’m Alan Hall. And we will catch you next week on the Uptime Wind Energy Podcast.
https://weatherguardwind.com/onyx-ceo-turbine-failures/
Renewable Energy
States Calculate Onshore Wind Opportunities
Weather Guard Lightning Tech
States Calculate Onshore Wind Opportunities
In September, when some farmers and homeowners in St. Joseph County in north-central Indiana received letters from German-based UKA Group about the company’s interest in developing a new wind farm, it wasn’t necessarily welcome news. A handful of the letter recipients took to social media to state their opposition. But for the western edge of neighboring state Ohio, wind has provided a significant economic boost for small communities.
Sparsely-populated Paulding County Ohio is home to fewer than 19,000 residents, three utility-scale wind farms, and one-and-a-half solar farms.
Each year from 2015-2020, the county saw roughly $2.5 million in “pilot payments,” pre-tax investments the county negotiated to be paid prior to the project’s completion. (More money was to be paid out once all of the turbines came online.) In 2020, Jerry Zielke, then Paulding County’s economic development director, told Ohio reporter Rod Hissong the new wind farm has been “a really really great opportunity for us and our community financially and it really has helped our economy here in Paulding County.”
Local media chronicled the process, explaining how the money generated was spent, invested, and shared in a variety of ways – including $120,000 in annual scholarships for local students.
Wayne Trace schools were an obvious beneficiary. According to the Spectrum article, “Wayne Trace Superintendent Ben Winans said since the school started receiving wind farm money in 2013 they’ve hired 18 new teachers. ” Winans also noted that the GAP closing – getting lower-performing students to achieve at higher levels – “improved from an ‘f’ to an ‘A,’ ” he told SpectrumOne.
Since then, Paulding County’s new economic development director, Tim Copsey, has increased the county’s income by negotiating to bring two solar farms to the area. Timber Road Solar Farm has been supplying local farmers with a “drought resistant form of income” since it came online in 2023.

Image credit: EDP and Timber Road Solar Farm (Ohio map) and Google Maps (Indiana map inset, below)
Will Indiana WElcome a New Wind Farm?

It may be an uphill battle for the UKA wind farm.
St. Joseph County recently enacted an ordinance to deter solar power generation in the county. But, the state already generates 3,368 MW – more than three times what Ohio’s wind farms generate – and another 302 MW are under construction, according to the US DOE and American Clean Power.
And it’s not a new development – according to the Indiana Office of Energy Development, wind energy has been part of the state’s fuel mix since 2006.
In Illinois, Indiana’s neighbor to the west, 7665 MW, or about 12% of the state’s energy, is derived from wind.
Will Indiana continue to do as other states do – including its neighbors, and other farming states like Iowa, and even oil-rich Texas – and sell wind power to fuel income for their state and county budgets? Time will tell, and we’ll be watching as things develop.
You also might be interested in: New Jersey’s Electricity Rate Crisis is a Perfect Storm for Wind Energy
For regular updates on wind and other renewable development projects, technologies, and news, subscribe to the Uptime Tech News newsletter and tune in to the Uptime Wind Energy Podcast.
https://weatherguardwind.com/states-calculate-onshore-wind-opportunities/
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